Curse

Stormlord Alex · Dec 18, 2007, 09:38 PM // 21:38

Quote:

Do they really have the same AI?

It's the bald that does it.
Seriously. Look at Vin Diesel. Awesome and bald. Coincidence?
I think not.

Mark Nevermiss · Dec 18, 2007, 09:44 PM // 21:44

I dont know but I tried Livia and Olias both with a generic jagged bones build, and Livia was always ahead of Olias in terms of the number of minions summoned and maintained.

On another note, beating AI at enchanting minions with death nova and jagged bones[if used] is really very hard. TBH there is no way in hell I'd play a MM on my necro. Its way too much work for me.

Online Gamer · Dec 18, 2007, 10:56 PM // 22:56

yea some people think that

Quaker · Dec 18, 2007, 11:43 PM // 23:43

I don't know if it's "work" so much, but you spend so much time making minions, healing minions, healing yourself, etc., you don't get to see the action.

I haven't played my Necro since Heroes arrived

Online Gamer · Dec 19, 2007, 01:13 AM // 01:13

lol good point i like pulling them and then making a meatshield and then rangers barrage and ele fire storm the hell out of them. Also warriors go in and do some damage and the meat shields take all the damage so the tanks don't take any. It works well =D

blue.rellik · Dec 19, 2007, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quaker

I'm not sure where you're getting this 10% figure, but it's not the sac from BotM. BotM costs 5% of your health plus 2% for each minion healed - with 10 minions, that's 25%. With 300HP that would be 75HP, but with 1/2 sac it would be 37.5HP. (which is still 1/4 of the sac without AotL)
But at any rate, I find that Livia doesn't use BotM all that much, she tends to make new minions instead. When she does use it (which is nearly always after the battle), she loses about 131HP (23% of 570) which is nearly negated by the 110HP she gets from Heal Area (with 8 in HP).
In any case, with sufficient corpses, she is able to maintain 9 minions more or less constantly, whether she uses Flesh Golem or Jagged Bones and in spite of not using AotL. (she's using [wiki]Dark Bond[/wiki] atm, btw, but that's also in "testing phase" along with Jagged Bones.)

She seems to survive a lot better with more health. Jagged Bones doesn't seem to be any better in the long run, then Flesh Golem.

Dude what? That means you had 600 without AotL which means you're using vigor runes

You NEVER user vigor runes with a MM. When I MM, I use 2 sups and all radiants + attunement (and bloodstained) which means I have like 180ish health with AotL. With 10 minions, that's 45/2 = 22.5 (round up in this case), 23 life per use.

Dangerous what?

Turbobusa · Dec 19, 2007, 09:19 AM // 09:19

Erm with Aotl you can easily use vigor runes, it's not like 10hp more to sac is hard to heal. On normal MMs though I agree.

Estic · Dec 19, 2007, 09:50 AM // 09:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

Erm with Aotl you can easily use vigor runes, it's not like 10hp more to sac is hard to heal. On normal MMs though I agree.

But if you use AotL what's the point in using a vigor?

Washi · Dec 19, 2007, 09:57 AM // 09:57

Flesh Golem has one really awesome feature. He is level 26 at 16 dm and there is one crazy overpowered skill that exploits this.

[skill]Ancestors' Rage[/skill]

If you use it on FG it counts as if he does the damage, and because he is high level, the damage is much higher due to damage formula.

Magikarp · Dec 19, 2007, 10:02 AM // 10:02

wtf's going on in this thread? so many people posting so many wrong and crazy things...

just follow the better advice of using Jagged Bones, OoU, or AotL. Flesh Golem just isn't as good as those choices.

boom, thread over.. now please end this jumble of nonsense.

ZenRgy · Dec 19, 2007, 10:28 AM // 10:28

AotL/Jagged Bones + Jaggeds / Horrors + Death Nova = epic.

Death Nova is crazy damage, especially if you renew minions rather than sitting there and spamming BotM since minion degen over time will just become so heavy it's ridiculous managing it.

Or you could bring an SS/Barbs/Curse hero and watch Minions + Barbs tear everything apart.

blue.rellik · Dec 19, 2007, 11:06 AM // 11:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

Erm with Aotl you can easily use vigor runes, it's not like 10hp more to sac is hard to heal. On normal MMs though I agree.

As Estic said, why?

Turbobusa · Dec 19, 2007, 11:10 AM // 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estic

But if you use AotL what's the point in using a vigor?

Easy MMing. get your minions up, spam Botm as needed.
The main attract of AotL is the quarter sac to allow you to keep your minions alive.
Whether you lose 37or 25 hp a sac instead of 100, I think you're happy enough.
I understand and agree why you wouldn't want any vigor on a normal MM, there is just less impact of bringing one on a AotL MM. Of course if you can afford the perfect equipement you should go for that, though I wouldn't lower my HP below 200.

System_Crush · Dec 19, 2007, 11:18 AM // 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estic

But if you use AotL what's the point in using a vigor?

Health stealing is not reduced by AotL, Arragodons where handing me my /ss yesterday, because 1 or 2 of their hits > than my total health.

By the time I figured I should not use AotL I was already at 40% DP.
It was however the large groups of raptors and not having an SS with us that made us fail the vanquish IM(I)O

But it's not like I have money or room to get another armor set with vigor instead of attuned.

odly · Dec 19, 2007, 11:43 AM // 11:43

When running a hero MM nothing beats Jagged Bones + Death Nova.

When playing an MM myself I like using [wiki]Icy Veins[/wiki] together with [wiki]putrid bile[/wiki]. This gives a pretty nice boom.

Washi · Dec 19, 2007, 12:41 PM // 12:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

Washi, this is wrong, the damage doesn't rely on the level of the damager, but on the armor of the foe and on the attibute of the skill.

I don't want to be rude but you need to play this game a little longer to understand some mechanics. If you don't know how damage is calculated why do you argue?

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10230697

Turbobusa · Dec 19, 2007, 12:49 PM // 12:49

First that's an exception, secondly, 2 years not enough?
Gratz on reading a 10 days old thread and spreading the news as if it was old knowledge.
Yeah, you were rude.

Stormlord Alex · Dec 19, 2007, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

First that's an exception,

Actually, the Flesh Golem thing isn't an 'exception' - it's just how damage from spells works in Guild Wars.
If a level 5 Ele casts a Flare saying it'll do 27 damage, and a level 20 Ele casts a Flare doing 27 damage as well, the level 20 Ele will deal more damage.

IIRC, though, damage from Weapons is not affected by level - a level 17 Warrior with 14 Swordsmanship will deal as much damage as a level 20 Warrior with 14 Swords; as weapon damage is calculated independently of level (albeit with a lower crit rate... ugh, so many things to remember

)

Just clearing a few things up.

Washi · Dec 19, 2007, 01:09 PM // 13:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

First that's an exception, secondly, 2 years not enough?
Gratz on reading a 10 days old thread and spreading the news as if it was old knowledge.
Yeah, you were rude.

LOL @ "spreading the news"

I just pointed out the only good thing about a golem. Cause other than that it's usefulness is rather questionable.

And if you are oh so experienced you should've known how spells work.

Estic · Dec 19, 2007, 01:30 PM // 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

Easy MMing. get your minions up, spam Botm as needed.
The main attract of AotL is the quarter sac to allow you to keep your minions alive.
Whether you lose 37or 25 hp a sac instead of 100, I think you're happy enough.
I understand and agree why you wouldn't want any vigor on a normal MM, there is just less impact of bringing one on a AotL MM. Of course if you can afford the perfect equipement you should go for that, though I wouldn't lower my HP below 200.

But if you use AotL in combo with Mystic Regeneration things are not going to one shot kill you. Whether you have 180 or 200 hp. Then it is a question of whether or not you can have full health for the next hit that comes through. If you do not run a vigor rune chances are greater that MR has your health at max before the next hit. Using vigors actually makes it harder MM'ing if you ask me.

This of course omits exceptions like the life steal by the Angorodrons as pointed out by System Crush. But using AotL in that area is pretty much suicide anyway. Sup vigor or not.